So what constitutes "low chill" apple?

[Applenut]

I'm debating what constitutes a "low chill" apple. Anna apple obviously qualifies as it blossoms heavily with a compact bloom period around mid-January in these here parts and is very fruitful. However, Northern Spy blossoms just as heavily, only three months later, also with a compact bloom period, and is very fruitful (and terrible quality in our heat, but that's another discussion).

In other parts of the country, you have early season apples, mid-season, and late season. Just because Ein Shemer blossoms earlier in the season than Northern Spy, does that make Northern Spy any less "low chill" if it has the same compact bloom period, only later in the season?

If we just use the compactness of the bloom period to gauge chill requirement, we could say anything that blooms completely in say, 2 weeks, would be low chill. 4 weeks to completely blossom would be medium-chill, and several months to blossom completely would be high-chill (not a reason to reject it outright, if indeed the fruit quality is good the whole time; I can see where this would benefit the home gardener).

If we used the 2-week rule for determining chilling requirement, I would consider the following "low chill" so far;

Nittany
Ribston Pippin
Maiden Blush
Liberty
Ashmead's Kernel
Sierra Beauty
Rome Beauty
Northern Spy
Lord Lamborne
Lady
Williams' Pride
GoldRush
Enterprise
American Summer Pearmain
Gala
Melrose
Cinnamon Spice
Dixie Red Delight
Wealthy

...and about a dozen others, as even with our meager 250 hours of chill this year, these are blooming quite well. I'd like to hear some other discussion on this, as its gotten to the point where I about go bonkers when I hear the term "low-chill".

Applenut

[macmanmatty]

wow all those are blooming with 250 chill hours??!! Some of those are listed as over 1000 chill hours! Then I should be able to grow all most all apples with my mighty 600 hours of chill. This is really interesting info.

[Applenut]

I snicker when I see people in Zone 8 wondering if they can grow apples. ANY apple will grow and fruit here in zone 10a, they just act differently than they do in a cold climate. But they still set fruit buds and blossom as much as they would with chill; it just takes longer for the blossoms to open (months sometimes, which would drive commercial growers insane.

Ignore the chilling hours on apples and just plant what you want (I'm afraid that does not apply to stonefruit however).

Applenut

[cebury]

AppleNut,

If you're still lurking around (or subscribed to this thread) -- please post more! You're posts are as interesting as they are informative. And of course encouraging me to spend more $$ to plant DWN apples ;-)

[LeeAnn Barton]

many of us at Dave Wilson agree, chill hours with apples are more flexible than chill hours with stone fruit.
I definitely think the primary concern with getting a good tasting apple is the amount of heat it will tolerate during (and up to) ripening time.
I would like for you to repost your list with notations next to the apples that are most satisfactory or excellent in taste in addition to performing well in your 250 hours.

Thanks!

[Applenut]

That's a good question LeeAnn, as any apple will fruit in a warm climate (although the pattern may be a bit strange), but heat-tolerance should be considered way before chilling hour needs. Northern Spy fruits fine here, but the quality is absolutely horrible, tasting like tasteless mashed potatoes mixed with sawdust.

Finding heat-tolerant varieties is a bit of a quandry, as good ones have come from every climate and latitude. Yes, Dorsett Golden (Bahamas) does well here, but so does Bramley (England). Wealthy (Minnesota) is very good, and last year Honeycrisp (Minnesota) was outstanding despite a very, very hot September (Tom Spellman tasted it also, so I have witnesses). Some apples, like Arkansas Black, are much better I feel down here than the ones grown in the mountains.

On the other hand, Braeburn, from a warm climate down under, should have done well; instead, it ripens way too early and was terrible three years in a row until I finally pulled it out. I'm afraid there is no shortcuts to finding well-adapted varieties short of actually growing them and seeing how they do.

But to give you an abreviated list, here is our favorites from tasting last year, when we had an extremely hot fall:

Rubinette (a Cox cross that is considered the best wherever it's grown)
Anna (a great apple that's unappreciated because it is so common and easy to grow; makes killer pies)
Dorsett Golden (ditto above)
Pristine
Williams' Pride
Bramley Seedling
Stump
Hawaii (tastes great even when very green and unripe)
GoldRush (ripe apples hang on the tree for months)
Dixie Red Delight
Mollie's Delicious ("Delicious" in the name turns people off to it; pity)
Nittany
Wickson Crab
Red Boskoop (sweet-tart flavor about blows you head off)
Sierra Beauty (ditto above)
Lady Williams
Granny Smith (leave on the tree to December for a taste you never thought possible)
Arkansas Black
Fuji

I cycle through about 20 varieties a year, pulling out losers and trying new recruits. I used to avoid varieties from the far North and England, but the success of Honeycrisp shocked me into not haveing such pre-conceived notions that would limit an excellent apple from being introduced here. Such thinking has deprived warm climates of a range of apples that could have been growing here for 100 years now had someone had the initiative to try them.

[fruitman60]

As was discussed in another forum....be careful about planting fruit trees (including apple) that are NOT suited to your climate. There is a reason why respected fruit growers/sellers tout low chill varieties for low chill areas (including apple). Some problems encountered when planting inappropriate trees involve other things besides just fruit set. One example certainly is the failure of branches to leaf out in Spring. This results in sun damaged fruit....along with damaged branch bark and trunks.

[Applenut]

Sunburn is indeed a risk when growing apples in a hot climate. In Llano, California (in the high desert of the Antelope Valley) is Bryan Ranch Ultralight Airport and U-pick orchard http://www.brianranch.com/. Yes, you're asking why such an odd combination, well, when they were applying to the County for a Conditional Use Permit, apparently an Ultralight airport was not one of the categories. But they were allowed to do an orchard, and so the two have been linked for years now.

They commonly get 120F heat and have learned a thing or two about protecting the fruit trees. Some apples are much more prone to sunburn than others, and it doesn't always follow conventional wisdom (Pristine has a porcelin skin, but resists burning; on the other hand, GoldRush gets fried). On these sensitive varieties they thin so that there is a sacrificial fruit in front of a good one that will take the sunburn, protecting the one behind it. On trees that are late to leaf out I coat the trunk and horizontal branches with white latex paint thinned 50% with water, which protects it well from sunburn and resultant borer infections. On trees that leaf out earlier I only do the trunks.

[rasputinj]

AppleNut,

Where are you located? I am in Simi Valley. I have Gala, Pettingill, Anna, Golden Dorsett, Pink Lady. I would love to have something like a HoneyCrisp, Arkansas Black, I am just worried about investing in something that if I follow conventional wisdom would not work.

Do you know where you can get a Hawaii and what do you need to pollinate it?

[Applenut]

Rasputinj:

I'm in Riverside. Ignore the conventional wisdom (it's wrong).

Applenut